Peter and I discussed something at dinner yesterday that I have to share. We have travelled a lot, and on many of our trips we have met new people who have generously offered us this or that. It doesn't matter if they were rich or poor. Even people who had no electricity or running water have generously offered us to eat and drink what they have.
Inviting ... but not inviting
There are, of course, many generous people in Sweden as well, but every now and then we have people who first suggest that you visit them, and then think "why don't we share the cost of the meat" or "why don't you bring some wine". I don't know about you, but I get an uneasy feeling in my stomach. A lot of times it's people who think that there should be beef, seafood and fine wines on the table, but they've mortgaged the house so much that it stings a bit.
Can't you bid simply ...?
I don't mind being invited for pasta with meat sauce or cauliflower soup. But I want to be invited! I want to feel that the host or hostess actually wants to share whatever they have. Is it just me who realises that it can be like this in Sweden? And if so, what is it that makes us so stingy? Is it the feeling that things have to be so perfect, or do we just not want to share with our friends?
BP says:
My husband, who is from England, was faking just like you when he came here. Is what you write typically Swedish, perhaps? I really don't know.
Personally, I find it much more fun to be invited and to invite myself. We invite each other for coffee even at work and take turns. Significantly more fun than paying individually.
Exception: notice it's an explicit potluck where everyone contributes something.
And I would never offer an ox file either, finger prawns are not for us.
15 September 2013 - 21:06
Ditte says:
Perhaps we Swedes are generally stingy? There are so many musts. And it often "has" to be perfect. If someone invites me, there is no obligation on my part. Then I might want to bring a flower or a present, but that's another matter.
Our stinginess can also include time. Giving your time in this country can be difficult. It seems to be in short supply. But what are we rushing to do?
The fact that someone invites you and then suggests that you share the costs seems strange to me. It is better not to do so or to take it easy. Because it is the togetherness and the joy of it that is important. But if you invite people to a potluck, it's a completely different matter. Then you know in advance what the rules are.
And sure, you can have different opinions...
15 September 2013 - 22:16
s p i n d e l t j e j e n (mummy life, photography, travelling and stuff like that) says:
I SOOOO agree with you!
Had a friend (former friend) who was just like that. She was happy to be invited but when you went to her she calculated the smallest cost. If you asked her if you wanted to come there and have lunch, she had calculated what it would cost - and sometimes we shared the costs when we shopped and then if she had some at home in the fridge, she calculated what we would pay for what we took there.
Nope, that's going AWAY! 😉
15 September 2013 - 23:19
Maggan and Ingemar says:
We have also experienced that in other countries they are much more generous than here in Sweden, even to people they do not know. Germans especially, we met some on a stpl and talked for a few minutes only, then the wife in HB came out and gave us 8 small bottles with different kinds of liqueurs. At another campsite where we also got into conversation with some Germans in a motorhome, there we got travel food, a jar of cookies. As for dinners, I have not experienced what you describe but have heard of something similar. We Swedes are probably more rigid here at home, but abroad we offer more food and drink.
15 September 2013 - 23:44
Emmy in Australia says:
It's interesting that you bring this up, and it's one of many reasons why I feel more comfortable outside of Sweden. Swedes in general (serious generalisation of course) are often quite stingy with food, entertainment and social time compared to other cultures. Here in Australia, you can sit around all day grilling and chatting for no particular reason but just because you enjoy being together. The more you share (according to your own ability of course) the more you get back. In every way! Strictly speaking, it definitely makes for a more frugal life. A: Of course it's the same motorhome that has been in my blog before, but I think it's so cool that I wanted to include it again!
16 September 2013 - 2:31
admin says:
BP, I suspect that this is a rather Swedish behaviour... Knytkalas can be an exception, absolutely! But then you decide that from the beginning. It's not just about money either, but it's a simple and somewhat fun way to meet.
Ditte, it's interesting that you write that stinginess can also include time. I haven't thought about that, but I think you're right! As I said, I agree that being stingy is another matter.
Spider girl, oh how sad! It is exactly the stingy attitude that becomes so boring. You offer sometimes and get invited back sometimes, is that so difficult??
Maggan and Ingemar, interesting to hear that you also experienced more generosity abroad. You may well be right that we also become more generous when we ourselves go abroad. You are influenced by the mentality around you.
Emmy in Australia, it's interesting that you also bring up the issue of social time. I hadn't thought of that before, but I guess it could be! "Time is money", we say... haha.
16 September 2013 - 6:55
Anna Stouvenel says:
During all the years I still lived in Sweden, the dinner party culture did not exist in my circles. You had coffee loudly and freely. It was only when I came to France that this question came up. Here you can hardly meet without eating something together. Food is such an incredibly important social phenomenon. When you are invited, you almost always bring a bottle of wine (which you rarely open because the hosts have already decided which wine goes with their food creation). For birthdays and other special occasions, you can bring a bottle of champagne. Flowers aren't bad either. I always take sweets with me for the children. I think Sweden hasn't come that far yet, it's still the coffee culture and the Friday cosy that rules.
16 September 2013 - 7:40
Frankie & Co says:
We 'imported' Pot Luck and have family and friends over quite often and share each other's dishes, i.e. invite each other - very fun, tasty and appreciated.
16 September 2013 - 8:05
year says:
My view, having lived in Sweden for many years, is that people like to take, but find it incredibly difficult to give. Let alone thank you, you don't. In general, in the circles we have come into, people walk in "small shoes".
As an example, I can say that over the years we have had all the children's playmates and friends on board. Almost every day we have been able to ensure that at least one ate with them, so there has been food for that. It is the same children who have come .... but if our children have been with their friends, they come home when the family has to eat. Always. A little strange, but we have maintained that WE want to - we think it is nice to also be able to be together during meals.
16 September 2013 - 10:03
Alexandra says:
Hahah "share the cost of the meat". Don't know how I would react if you sit at dinner with someone and then in the middle of everything they say that.
I agree with you! But I do not know if it is necessarily because we are stingy...or if we are just very rigid. Like, we don't dare to invite people because we are afraid that the guests will think we want to brag and show off that we can afford to invite them, etc. In general, I think that we Swedes are a little afraid to socialise with others without worrying about this and that.
If you invite someone to dinner, you invite them! If you have to pay together, you have to organise a potluck together. The exception may well be if you have a "home party" and then you can bring what you want to drink yourself ...
So I think that it has become a culture that you should share everything equally so as not to show that you have better than someone else, the law of the jungle you know. 😉 So you don't want to brag...not that we are stingy.
16 September 2013 - 10:23
Cat's Considerations says:
I really recognise your description. Especially since I have lived in a multicultural family with family members from all corners of the world. They are much more generous than Swedes are! Agree with many of the blog posts.
16 September 2013 - 13:03
admin says:
Anna Stouvenel, thanks for some input from France! That's probably starting to come to Sweden too, but as you say, we may be a little behind...
Frankie & Co, sounds like a super nice import!
🙂
Ann, how sad that we should be so stingy! We have also always had other people's children with us, both at dinners and on trips!
Alexandra, maybe you're right that it's a bit of a jantelag as well... But you don't always have to offer so incredibly luxurious (a bit of a jantelag now haha), if you don't want to brag....
Katta, understand that these differences become even more apparent when you've lived in several different cultures!
16 September 2013 - 14:13
Lena & Jan says:
It has for several years "gone downhill with the bidding culture" in Sweden. I think it is time to realise that meeting and bidding is the most important thing! It was better in the past when it was really scarce for many, but then we were trained in our workplaces that "everything must be profitable" and now we see the result, believes a happy pensioner!
16 September 2013 - 15:57
admin says:
Lena & Jan, I don't really know how it has been historically... but I absolutely agree that the best thing is to meet and invite simply! Of course it can be fun to have an extra nice party sometimes, but it doesn't always have to be that way!
16 September 2013 - 18:06
Mum's machete says:
Exciting post and discussion! I certainly agree on many points. But I don't know if Swedes are particularly stingy? I rather feel that many are "ashamed" a bit to "be invited", as if they feel they "owe something back" then? Or "right should be right" (whatever that is?!). Perhaps we are more pretentious in a kind of "I shouldn't be too proud" way? This is certainly very much related to Swedes' culturally poor social skills, just as pointed out in the comments above, the difficulties in socialising with new acquaintances. A major cultural handicap that has produced many new foreign Swedes over the years! Hugs!
16 September 2013 - 19:18
Synne says:
I would never dream of charging my guests - on the contrary, I like to offer and preferably generously! However, if someone comes and stays for a long time, he or she may shop on his or her own and cook or offer dinner or maybe buy some wine, but that is never something I assume. Next time it's me who is the guest! I also don't like it when someone invites you to a party and charges you for the envelope fee, what should you "invite" to a party for?
17 September 2013 - 14:40
Inga M says:
Sharing the cost of the meat afterwards sounds awful! We spend a lot of time together and have many food-loving friends. And there are different variations. When we do something here at home, we offer everything, it feels natural. But often we socialise outdoors on a rock by the lake or at a barbecue area, and then we often suggest knyte. But maybe it's typically Swedish, but it doesn't feel like stinginess.
18 September 2013 - 7:02
admin says:
Mum's machete, maybe that's it... There is a culture of sharing things (sharing the bill for example), so maybe you're right. Although in some cases I can experience a certain stinginess too...
😉
Synne, if you live with someone for a long time, it feels natural to help in one way or another, I hope.
No M, knytis does not have to be stingy, I think, but rather a way to easily meet without so much preparation. It can also be fun if you invite each other.
18 September 2013 - 7:28
Pupa says:
I also think that if you're buying, you're buying. However, I usually recommend my friends to bring their own wine if they want to drink it because neither I nor my husband drink wine and do not have the faintest idea of what is good.
20 September 2013 - 13:28